dvawolk
Full Member
DSR2 125mm open system (actual project)
Posts: 273
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Post by dvawolk on Oct 25, 2021 15:12:16 GMT -8
Scenario:
Will be used in a house, looking for some 7"-8" batchbox heat output. Material chamote, vermiculite boards, good/new insulated chimney with appropriate dimension, 5 metres high.
I have used 6" P-channel batchbox for many seasons now and I like it. But time is coming to move to a new land and to build a new heater :-).
For my scenario, what would be the most reliable and user friendly from the batchbox heaters collection that i mentioned (can be some other similar option, that i am not aware of). Which batchbox is the most reliable? I only have experience with original batchbox with P and F channels... What about DSR2 open/closed system, DSR3 or original Vortex? Are these similar in reliability?
What option would you prefer and why? Is your opinion experience based?
P.S.: I do like the additional option of vortex imagery ;-) if it does not come with stability/reliability problems...
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Post by Jura on Oct 26, 2021 4:11:07 GMT -8
I support Klemen's question.
I'm especially interested in the vortex firebox behaviour applied in a cooktop with a blind bench
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Post by Vortex on Oct 26, 2021 9:47:47 GMT -8
Scenario: Will be used in a house, looking for some 7"-8" batchbox heat output. Material chamote, vermiculite boards, good/new insulated chimney with appropriate dimension, 5 metres high. I have used 6" P-channel batchbox for many seasons now and I like it. But time is coming to move to a new land and to build a new heater :-). For my scenario, what would be the most reliable and user friendly from the batchbox heaters collection that i mentioned (can be some other similar option, that i am not aware of). Which batchbox is the most reliable? I only have experience with original batchbox with P and F channels... What about DSR2 open/closed system, DSR3 or original Vortex? Are these similar in reliability? What option would you prefer and why? Is your opinion experience based?P.S.: I do like the additional option of vortex imagery ;-) if it does not come with stability/reliability problems... I haven't built the others so cant give an opinion on those, but as far as the Vortex stove goes the biggest anyone has built is 6", so a 7 or 8" would be unknown territory. It scales down OK so ought to scale up as well but cant guarantee it. By "original Vortex" I presume you are referring to my present stove? I find it very stable and reliable, but no one else has built one with the same mass setup, and that's where a couple have had issues. To function properly the Vortex stove needs the correct balance between the push of the expanding firebox gasses and the pull of the chimney draw, the top chamber has to create the right amount of resistance to convert the rapid forward motion of the gases through the port into vortex spin in the afterburner. If you use a different mass it will change that, and the top chamber and air supply have to be adjusted to re-balance it. A mass or barrel, especially one with contraflow channels will slow down the gas flow and so you then need larger air inlets to compensate, as the slower gas flow delivers less air to the fire, also a slower gas flow needs less top chamber resistance to maintain the vortex in the afterburner. I think it's probably the case with other designs except it's less obvious, the afterburner window shows you when it's right and there's no hiding it when it's not. It runs best on full loads, if you have to reload it's best done after the peak of the burn and before the start of the coaling phase, with just one or 2 large pieces. I support Klemen's question. I'm especially interested in the vortex firebox behavior applied in a cooktop with a blind bench Same as above, if you take those things to heart you shouldn't have any problems. I don't know how the new dedicated cookstove design will behave on a mass as I haven't tried that out yet, but cant see there being much of a difference - so let us know once you've built it  |
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dvawolk
Full Member
DSR2 125mm open system (actual project)
Posts: 273
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Post by dvawolk on Oct 27, 2021 1:48:30 GMT -8
Hi, Vortex, thanks for a reply. Yes i meant your current version of a stove. So the 6" vortex stove can be used with similar ISA as regular batchbox (so 5 to 5.3 sq. meters) if coupled with a good chimney. I am talking about chamote bells for heat extraction - no channels.. I prefer full loads with my regular batchbox, too. I like the point you said : that those vorteces are kind of "visual confirmation" that turbulence is going on and that gasses are mixing well. |
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Post by Vortex on Oct 27, 2021 11:17:15 GMT -8
It's not just the turbulence, it also shows if you have the correct amount of air, too much and the vortex will not form completely, just making a palm tree/fire fountain shape, too little and vortex flame will start to stream out of the afterburner up into the top chamber.
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Post by Orange on Oct 30, 2021 12:52:32 GMT -8
I had the same question so I decided to gamble a bit with DSR2/Batchblock style and seems great, I'm only slighty concerned with the smell of insulation.
Most reliable/user friendly is probably original BB, I remember only fiedia has some problems with dirty burns. |
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Post by fiedia on Oct 31, 2021 1:30:03 GMT -8
Dirty smokes came from the fact that I used a "prototype" design of the door with air flow inside the frame. The inlet CS was too big wich enabled thermal overdrive when small burning cedar.
Reducing the inlets helped stabilizing the fire. It was a 5" (125mm) design.
I am now building an 8" batchbox (200mm). I am mainly concerned by the lack of experience on DSR or vortex stoves for this diameter. In addition I built 2 batch prototypes and feel more comfortable with this design than starting over with a DSR or Vortex type
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Post by josephcrawley on Dec 30, 2021 15:21:35 GMT -8
Scenario: Will be used in a house, looking for some 7"-8" batchbox heat output. Material chamote, vermiculite boards, good/new insulated chimney with appropriate dimension, 5 metres high. I have used 6" P-channel batchbox for many seasons now and I like it. But time is coming to move to a new land and to build a new heater :-). For my scenario, what would be the most reliable and user friendly from the batchbox heaters collection that i mentioned (can be some other similar option, that i am not aware of). Which batchbox is the most reliable? I only have experience with original batchbox with P and F channels... What about DSR2 open/closed system, DSR3 or original Vortex? Are these similar in reliability? What option would you prefer and why? Is your opinion experience based?P.S.: I do like the additional option of vortex imagery ;-) if it does not come with stability/reliability problems... Having built a couple of each p channel, floor channel and dsr2 stoves of varying sizes I have to say the p channel is definitely the least finicky. The way the primary air blasts straight into the fire burns fat better from the start than the other styles. The dsr2 is definitely the most finicky with a long slow start up if cold. The lack of a vertical riser to supercharge the burn early on really shows. Another observation is the p-channel steel seems to last longer than the floor channel but obviously is more difficult to replace. |
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