kpl
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Post by kpl on Nov 2, 2014 12:27:37 GMT -8
By the way, I actually tried to stack some bricks. Did not expect a lot, as materials were soaking wet and just above freezing, and just stacked, without clay. Did not have any really dry firewood too. It was difficult to start, as the smoke did not want to go to riser, but when it started, it burned quite well. Draft was quite good even when I placed a barrel over the riser. Sorry for the crappy video, it's just a phone and I had only a headlight. Do not have any heat resistant glass either, to be able to see inside. youtu.be/sclwelzo6DYChannel to the riser was located in the ceiling, at the very end of the firebox. Then gases went into riser, which had a step in it, to make a bit of turbulence, then just normal square riser. Did not make a special secondary air channel, as it had plenty of open seams anyway.
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Oct 30, 2014 12:29:46 GMT -8
why not the sided batchbox? It does not quite fit in the given space anyway. I would like not to exceed the floor space of a 200L barrel (about 60cm=2 feet), with square brick base just a little bit wider than that, so it would be possible to enclose lowest part of a barrel with bricks. Actually that increases *inside* dimensions to the same 60cm, so probably it can be squeezed in.
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Oct 30, 2014 8:54:34 GMT -8
By the way, looking at his last experiment with water bucket. Looks like that stove is not connected to a real chimney at all, so all the gas movement has to be created in a stove alone, without further suction. How can that happen without a "rocket" - it does not look like he's using one. That centrifugal box alone most probably does not produce any suction.
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Oct 30, 2014 6:32:00 GMT -8
sure, this design is good, but in that tiny space even that part of firebox sticking out of a barrel, is a problem. So, if rocket is not gonna work, means there will be no rocket. Or, more probably, several months of waiting, as it had to be started several months earlier.
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Oct 29, 2014 11:33:58 GMT -8
I'm not here to insult anybody, or to convince I'm smart or whatever, just to understand. I know several of you here have spent years trying this stuff, that's exactly the reason I'm asking here.
If there are several critical aspects to get effective burn, probably those can be obtained other ways too. I basically do not see a big difference between short straight channel with fast movement of hot gas, which is located horizontally vs vertically. Or is it that sharp turn, which is critical?
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Oct 28, 2014 23:15:34 GMT -8
Issues to tackle: 1. The ram horn 2. Batch box modifications 3. Dispersion/pattern of gas flow through a mass, in my case an oven (that's another toughie)
So, yes, Peter is right. It won't work. But a girl can dream...
You know, answers like "it won't work" are like a red rag to a bull From my understanding, the ram horn is just for strong mixing of gases, which most probably can be done other ways too. Port from firebox to riser should be made with same area as for normal batch box, but with square shape, so it would fit inside round or square riser. At the transition from smaller port to bigger riser, there will be inevitable huge turbulence, and secondary air can be injected there as well easily, with just a small slit in lowest brick. Most probably it will not be as good as normal design, but shouldn't it be good enough, if there is a good length of a riser above? OK, anyway, if there is no real experience with this kind of setup, I have to try it myself, or use a known design. I'll try to draw something in sketchup, so there is actual stuff to speak about. www.dropbox.com/s/l0jkd4m3fk60lne/vertical1.skp?dl=0
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Oct 28, 2014 3:38:39 GMT -8
I would love to experiment, but it's already almost winter. I might actually just try to build it, as most probably it would burn and make heat anyway. I do not have gas analyzer anyway, so no way to tell if it's good or not.
I'm just thinking what are those parameters that are different in this setup, and what could I try to make them better.
As the port would be located at the very far end of firebox, it's general location would not be too different from the normal one. For turbulence, port sides could be angled or whatever, and port will be a bit smaller than CSA anyway. Secondary air can be injected here even simpler than the normal way, as it's not required to route p-channel down to the port, just a straight channel is enough. Riser should be insulated as usually, so no big difference in temperatures.
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Oct 28, 2014 2:01:10 GMT -8
And main reason for that would be increased turbulence?
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Oct 28, 2014 0:55:04 GMT -8
Hi,
I have read a lot of conversations here and a lot elsewhere on internet, and have tried several stacked brick setups myself, but no actual heater yet.
Has anybody tried to build a batch-box style heater, where heat riser would be located above the firebox, not at the end or side of it? The main idea is to save some space, so the firebox would not stick too much outside of the barrel's side.
Port would be located in a ceiling of firebox, P-channel can be built-in in the ceiling too, and a simple heat riser built above that. Port would not have normally accepted dimensions, it must be more like square or round.
I'm not hoping to get extremely clean burn or anything, just a reasonably working setup.
There is no chimney available there, but there is a hole in a wall just above where I want the heater located. So a simple stovepipe could be routed along the barrel to the top, and then routed outside. Some wool can be wrapped around it, if needed.
I want to heat a small rented workshop (about 25 sq.meters), to be able to use it occasionally during the winter. Idea is to build the lower part from old bricks, and use a barrel above that, getting some combination of quick heat with some amount of heat storage too. Heat storage is required when something has to dry in a workshop, like glue or varnish.
I know, simplest option is to pick up some cheap iron stove, but that would need some heat mass added anyway.
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Jul 31, 2014 23:43:00 GMT -8
Had to build it quickly, for the party on the next day. Has to be heated for about two hours, then it's hot enough to bake pizza in about 3 minutes. Pizza baking is absolutely not a common thing here in a nordic country, so most probably I am doing it absolutely wrong, but we love the result anyway.
I still want to build it with a rocket heater inside, but not quite the traditional way. General idea is to have the oven more wide than deep, and have the burner exhaust in the oven cavity at one side, not below the floor. Not sure if it would be able to heat the floor hot enough, probably need to direct some of the exhaust directly under the floor.
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Jul 31, 2014 4:04:04 GMT -8
Hi, Finally there is a topic where I can show something too, not only watch and read:) I also tried to cook some pizzas this summer, so had to improvise temporary pizza oven too. Current one looks like this: www.dropbox.com/sh/safxv4y0b6dsqgq/AAAJDNHrJ6yFIxmpjJ-JclYKa/pizza_oven#lh:null-2014-07-04%2021.01.03.jpgThis is the third version, second one was an attempt to use rocket-stove principle there, but that one was complete failure. I could not get it hot enough the way I had built it. Floor and ceiling is done using corundum plates 3x44x44 cm, that were lying around in the yard, as my father was building kilns for ceramics years ago. There are some peaces of rockwool too, which happened to be same thickness as corundum, so helped to stack it together. Sure it's ugly. Hopefully I will have a chance to build a proper, pizza oven. The block in front is movable, I leave a gap when there is fire burning inside, and close it when it is gone. That way heat stays in longer. Block itself has quite good insulation properties, it's called keramzit here, do not know if it's used elsewhere. Not quite designed for high-temp use.
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Mar 3, 2014 0:17:34 GMT -8
Would something like this help? Probably just a plate above the riser, so the stream does not shoot directly up, but can rise only if it's hotter than the gases already there.
+---------+ | | | +---+ | | | | | | # | | # |
+---------+ | | | +---+ | | | | # | | # |
Splitting masonry bell like proposed above would induce serious temp diff in a single layer of brick, which would increase cracking.
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Feb 26, 2014 1:57:47 GMT -8
Would concrete work for lower section of the bell, when the hotter upper part would still be steel barrel? I was thinking to use concrete street border blocks, which are extremely heavy but cheap as dirt. That way the stove's upper part would provide instant heat, but lower part would store a lot of heat for later. Those blocks could be stacked to create rectangular box, probably with just some kind of wool as gasket, without any mortar at all. That should work fine for workshop where good looks is not a requirement.
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Jan 16, 2014 12:49:44 GMT -8
There was a link in a different thread (given by Morticcio) where we could see several other creations of that guy, who built this very interesting setup. Looks like it's being already used commercially. rocket177.blogspot.nl/Check the links to articles on the right side, google translator in chrome browser helps a lot with them. Just basically wonderful stuff.
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kpl
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Post by kpl on Jan 4, 2014 12:06:43 GMT -8
Thanks morticio, his other stoves are also extremely interesting. I have full head of ideas, but most probably the first thing is to start building something, just to get the feeling.
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