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Post by robbie on Oct 15, 2020 11:37:19 GMT -8
Hi!, not sure if starting a new thread is the best idea, please correct me if I'm wrong.
I'm about to start building this design in my house and I have a few last questions for you geniuses. It's a kind of primitive version of the design that yasin gach does in France. Its core is based on peterbergs brick sidewinder sketchup, but reworked with the bricks of the kind available here in Spain. The riser is all fibreboard and the whole core wrapped in fibreboard too.
You will see in the pictures that I plan to have a bench. I prefer a mass to a bell-bench as I want the floor to heat up too as there are bedrooms below the slab...Peterberg himself warned me that there should be no bends in pipe. I'm realising that there are only 5.5 square metre of ISA in the system, including the pipe in the bench so I am tempted to make a bench bell. BUT...can I just enlarge the bench pipe to 300mm to give the required ISA??
I'm going to make it and test before I make the door/oven insert and just cover the gap with fibreboard....
I just took delivery of some very pricey ceramic fibre boards, so I'm now definitly going down this road!!!
Please advise! I cant get the picture to work, so here is a link
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Post by Vortex on Oct 15, 2020 12:02:24 GMT -8
You should be able to add them like this: [img]http://www.guejar.com/rocketstoves/loungside2.png[/img] [img]http://www.guejar.com/rocketstoves/loungside.png[/img] Edit: Seems to be the .png file format that's the problem. I uploaded them to my server and tried embedding them from there and they were still not displaying consistently, so I converted them to .jpg and they show OK then:
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Post by robbie on Oct 15, 2020 23:52:15 GMT -8
Thanks!!! I'll go for JPGs in the future
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Post by Orange on Oct 16, 2020 23:57:39 GMT -8
well people used pipes before and they work with a good draw (from chimney, riser). And batchblock has a bypass too. But I don't see how you'd heat anything in the lower floor...
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Post by pianomark on Oct 17, 2020 4:29:29 GMT -8
I think you will find that the floor of a bell (or beneath a bench) will not absorb any significant amount of heat, leave aside transmitting heat through to the bedroom below. That's why the floor of a bell is not included in the ISA.
Are you sure you want to pile this much weight above your bed? Be sure it is well supported!
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Post by robbie on Oct 19, 2020 0:44:30 GMT -8
the floor is well supported, it's a seismic concrete frame. I also removed a 3000kg masonry kitchen from the same spot! My hopes of heating the lower floor are through piping air through some hot part of the sytem and blowing it down a tube to the lower floor....
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Post by gadget on Oct 19, 2020 6:12:19 GMT -8
the floor is well supported, it's a seismic concrete frame. I also removed a 3000kg masonry kitchen from the same spot! My hopes of heating the lower floor are through piping air through some hot part of the sytem and blowing it down a tube to the lower floor.... If your going to use a blower to move some air, I would consider just pulling form the ceiling of the upper floor and pushing air to the floor of your down stairs. Do you have open stairs where the cold air settles down and the hot air rises back up?
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Post by robbie on Oct 21, 2020 0:38:22 GMT -8
gadget, if that works, it'll save a lot of mess! I'll see how the slab heats this winter and decide for next year!
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Post by Jura on Oct 22, 2020 1:22:55 GMT -8
.Peterberg himself warned me that there should be no bends in pipe. I also heard Peter's peterberg warnings about adding a pipe bench to a bell rocket. And I followed his advice. But then I can see shilo stoves with a ralatively small bell and very long piped bench. (he wrote me there is no any difference in his core comparing to a standard sidewinder) Is there any one who can explain that to me?
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Post by peterberg on Oct 22, 2020 8:47:17 GMT -8
But then I can see shilo stoves with a ralatively small bell and very long piped bench. (he wrote me there is no any difference in his core comparing to a standard sidewinder) Is there any one who can explain that to me? Well, I can have a stab at it... Way back in 2012 or 2013 Adiel and Shilo asked they could use duct with a square or rectangular cross-section since stove pipe is very expensive and hard to find in Israel. I figured they could, because the duct they would like to use (omega-shaped, to screw down to the floor) happened to be more than twice as large as system size csa. Plenty of space, lower gas velocity so bends wouldn't be such a problem. The picture doesn't show a standard sidewinder, though. Their particular variant is able to use a shorter riser without adverse effects.
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Post by robbie on Nov 2, 2020 12:07:46 GMT -8
Thanks again to all who have helped out, I'm now constructing the bell...I have a technical question: I have scaled the core to a 175mm system as that is the available tube. But now my floor channel is 67mm wide. I can only get 70x30 or 60x30 tube, so should I go bigger, or smaller? or do I need to fabricate my own tube, which will be tricky....? Thanks guys!!!
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Post by robbie on Nov 4, 2020 7:13:59 GMT -8
Thanks again to all who have helped out, I'm now constructing the bell...I have a technical question: I have scaled the core to a 175mm system as that is the available tube. But now my floor channel is 67mm wide. I can only get 70x30 or 60x30 tube, so should I go bigger, or smaller? or do I need to fabricate my own tube, which will be tricky....? Thanks guys!!! just got an answer on permies, 70x30 at my altitude! these forums are really amazing!
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Post by robbie on Dec 6, 2020 12:12:39 GMT -8
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Post by peterberg on Dec 6, 2020 13:00:56 GMT -8
Glad it worked out so well. The floor channel is looking good, you have a good eye for the finer details. These heater cores are indeed way off what could be considered as normal in the wood heaters world. There's one small thing you've got wrong on your blog, which is my name. It isn't Peter van der Eng but Peter van den Berg instead. It isn't important for the working of the heater, I assure you. But would you be so kind to correct it?
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Post by robbie on Dec 6, 2020 15:01:18 GMT -8
Glad it worked out so well. The floor channel is looking good, you have a good eye for the finer details. These heater cores are indeed way off what could be considered as normal in the wood heaters world. There's one small thing you've got wrong on your blog, which is my name. It isn't Peter van der Eng but Peter van den Berg instead. It isn't important for the working of the heater, I assure you. But would you be so kind to correct it? Sorry about that, I'm not sure how I got your name wrong after reading the entire content of your website several times!!! it's now corrected!
I'm still burning small amounts until the brick regains it's original dry colour...is that necessary or can I fill it right up and try get the temp high enough to burn all the smoke? Also, can I load it al the way to the back or leave the last part empty for better airflow?
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