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Post by peterberg on Nov 20, 2017 2:01:19 GMT -8
I wonder if the riser top plate/ oven floor was made of - lets say 5cm/2" refractory (or hard fire bricks); would it let the riser/ burn tunnel hot enough without any insulation? It would definitely give the oven solid floor heat! It can be done even simpler: having a bigger firebox and top box, the latter being the oven with a lower sideways exhaust opening. Of course the top box should be built out of hard fire bricks, preferably with insulation at the outside. All of the early experiments were done outdoors, all made of hard fire bricks and cast refractory. In hindsight, heating up did take more time, in the order of 5 to 7 minutes. After that it ran as clean as the Montana setup which was built entirely out of insulating fire bricks and ceramic glass. The answer to "Could this Vandenberg Stinger combustion core implemented as a real clean burning outdoor oven?" would be affirmative without a doubt.
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docbb
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Post by docbb on Nov 20, 2017 3:44:33 GMT -8
The answer to "Could this Vandenberg Stinger combustion core implemented as a real clean burning outdoor oven?" would be affirmative without a doubt. Hello Peter, do you mean something like this? cheers
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Post by peterberg on Nov 20, 2017 5:07:57 GMT -8
Not quite, the exhaust would be rather in the side of the oven instead. The port in the middle, and the oven wouldn't be a dome. I'd try to mimic the original double shoebox as close as possible.
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docbb
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Post by docbb on Nov 20, 2017 10:34:32 GMT -8
Not quite, the exhaust would be rather in the side of the oven instead. The port in the middle, and the oven wouldn't be a dome. I'd try to mimic the original double shoebox as close as possible. more like this then
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Post by pinhead on Nov 20, 2017 12:20:40 GMT -8
Not quite, the exhaust would be rather in the side of the oven instead. The port in the middle, and the oven wouldn't be a dome. I'd try to mimic the original double shoebox as close as possible. more like this then No. The area/volume immediately following the port must be in the same proportions to Peter's drawing if you expect it to operate similarly to Peter's design.
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Post by peterberg on Nov 20, 2017 14:46:03 GMT -8
more like this then No, not at all. I said: I'd try to mimic the original double shoebox as close as possible. Which means scaling up the whole of the double shoebox so the top box would be large enough to function as an oven. That's different than just combining parts what you seem to do. Did you ever built anything, by the way?
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docbb
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Post by docbb on Nov 20, 2017 17:40:11 GMT -8
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Post by satamax on Nov 20, 2017 23:36:10 GMT -8
more like this then No, not at all. I said: I'd try to mimic the original double shoebox as close as possible. Which means scaling up the whole of the double shoebox so the top box would be large enough to function as an oven. That's different than just combining parts what you seem to do. Did you ever built anything, by the way? Peter, someone will take your word! Imagine a batch shoebox, which will accommodate 4 pizzas! I just can't imagine the fuel that would be guzzling, and the temperature of the oven!
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Post by peterberg on Nov 20, 2017 23:56:47 GMT -8
Peter, someone will take your word! Imagine a batch shoebox, which will accommodate 4 pizzas! I just can't imagine the fuel that would be guzzling, and the temperature of the oven! Well, the pizza oven which is built each year during the MHA meeting guzzles loads of fuel to dry alone. After that before and during the traditional pizza party another shitload of fuel in order to bake 250 pizzas or more in a couple of hours. Maybe it would be a good idea to build one based on a Vandenberg Stinger core instead? Probably too late for 2018, maybe in 2019? What do you think about the term "Stinger"? It's referring to a rocket missile and also to a scorpion who's tail as the strongest weapon is coming back to its head. Much like the "Sidewinder" name for the sideways batch rocket.
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Post by peterberg on Nov 20, 2017 23:57:10 GMT -8
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manU
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Post by manU on Nov 21, 2017 4:11:39 GMT -8
My concern would be too much heat hitting the cooktop right over the Port. Metal there would probably get cherry red. I have had that experience with 5 and 6 inch L rockets. My suggestion is to try a flame deflector (rafractory slate). This will give more even distribution of the flame and help reducing the temp difference in the cooktop, and therefore warping or deformation. But more important, I have the "feeling" (because I don`t "have a testo") that it can also make combustion cleaner: the deflector could provide a "very hot crash surface" for the hot gases and create at the same time a violent turbulence (chaotic fountain?). There's no such thing as heating the cooktop too much, provided it's made of ceramic glass. Glass isn't a very good conductor, much less as compared to steel. A fair amount of heat will be kept inside the combustion area by using glass. I'd suspect a deflector plate would disturb the fire fountain, thereby killing off the clean combustion. Of course you've seen the videos, the glass is very clean, no soot to be seen anywhere once it's hot. Even the front window of the upper shoebox is clear. The fire fountain and the ceramic glass (Neoceram or Robax) are together a very good combination, much better than a cast iron cooktop would be. And also, glass won't warp and breaking it by overheating isn't a question. Proved by one of the participants who kept running this experiment untill 1:00 o'clock, an estimated constant firing time of 10 hours without destroying anything. Thank you for answering that Peter. What you said about ceramic glass properties is very interesting to me. I have no experience with it but soon I will have a couple Robax pieces to experiment. If you feel like providing any additional useful info about working with it I would appreciate it. But I know it may be off topic here... Thanks again, I will be following your development.
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Post by satamax on Nov 21, 2017 4:52:30 GMT -8
Peter, someone will take your word! Imagine a batch shoebox, which will accommodate 4 pizzas! I just can't imagine the fuel that would be guzzling, and the temperature of the oven! Well, the pizza oven which is built each year during the MHA meeting guzzles loads of fuel to dry alone. After that before and during the traditional pizza party another shitload of fuel in order to bake 250 pizzas or more in a couple of hours. Maybe it would be a good idea to build one based on a Vandenberg Stinger core instead? Probably too late for 2018, maybe in 2019? What do you think about the term "Stinger"? It's referring to a rocket missile and also to a scorpion who's tail as the strongest weapon is coming back to its head. Much like the "Sidewinder" name for the sideways batch rocket. Well, Peter, it's your invention. You choose the name. But to me, it's very "military" Further more american military. I like the shoebox. Reminds me of times past, when old style cobblers were still in existence. I wouldn't be as fussy about civilian rockets tho!
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Post by wiscojames on Nov 21, 2017 6:00:49 GMT -8
Damn military hardware manufacturers use up lots of good names. I like shoebox, but if Stinger catches on, I'd like to think that people will think of this invention instead of a shoulder launched surface to air missile when they hear the word. How about "duplex" batch core to reference the stacked boxes?
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Post by rakettimuurari on Nov 21, 2017 6:29:54 GMT -8
I kind of like these military terms so far... at least for sidewinder and stinger; they're heat seekers after all ... whereas anti-missile (or -rocket) system name could be seen as a bad omen ... castable Patriot core could sound weird in the ears of forum quests at least...? Actually I really like the terms around RMH and rocket field in general; they're organic and have various backgrounds - just like the members in their respective communities.
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Post by drooster on Nov 21, 2017 11:09:21 GMT -8
Well I like "Shoebox", and I'm fairly certain there won't be a S-A-M named that way anytime soon.
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