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Post by pyrophile on Oct 13, 2017 1:23:14 GMT -8
Hi all!
I am ending a 180mm batchbox stove, sidewinder type. The metal parts are not finished (made by somebody else) : I can not find the dimensions between the vertical part of the floor channel and the port. I think I remember something like the width of the port (or the base)... that is around 6.5 cm. It is a lot, am I wrong?
That is also the distance to the slopped or angled bricks on one hand and the distance to the back wall, on the other hand, right?
Maybe could it be written in the spreadsheet (I didn't see it)?
Thank you for your patience!
Benoit
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Post by pinhead on Oct 13, 2017 6:52:20 GMT -8
Hi all! I am ending a 180mm batchbox stove, sidewinder type. The metal parts are not finished (made by somebody else) : I can not find the dimensions between the vertical part of the floor channel and the port. I think I remember something like the width of the port (or the base)... that is around 6.5 cm. It is a lot, am I wrong? That is also the distance to the slopped or angled bricks on one hand and the distance to the back wall, on the other hand, right? Maybe could it be written in the spreadsheet (I didn't see it)? Thank you for your patience! Benoit The floor channel is much newer than the original P-Channel and batch box, so it's not yet in the spreadsheet. In order to add it, I'd need dimensional scaling equations in relation to the original batch box design, which I haven't seen posted yet. |
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Post by DCish on Oct 13, 2017 7:14:50 GMT -8
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dvawolk
Full Member
DSR2 125mm open system (actual project)
Posts: 271
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Post by dvawolk on Oct 13, 2017 10:36:08 GMT -8
Hi.
This distance has been answered in this thread.
I am not 100% sure but from my head I would say that the vertical sides of floor channel that are facing the port edges should have minimal distance of half the width of the port. If I recall there have been some sketches in this thread regarding this dimension as I was not sure either...
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Post by Orange on Oct 13, 2017 12:45:17 GMT -8
Klemen, how's the box working - things like exit temperature, bell and bench temperatures, oven temperature, hours needed to warm up and cool down...?
PS I've located suppliers of insulation firebrick and ceramic boards in the area, I can send you the details if you plan to build more.
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Post by pyrophile on Oct 15, 2017 6:53:35 GMT -8
Thankx Klemen, that is what I remembered, about 6.5cm, less than 2 inches. But on your drawings, the distance to the right hand wall seems smaller, no?
Benoit
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dvawolk
Full Member
DSR2 125mm open system (actual project)
Posts: 271
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Post by dvawolk on Oct 23, 2017 0:15:38 GMT -8
Klemen, how's the box working - things like exit temperature, bell and bench temperatures, oven temperature, hours needed to warm up and cool down...? PS I've located suppliers of insulation firebrick and ceramic boards in the area, I can send you the details if you plan to build more. Hi, Orange . Yes, i am interested about the suppliers... Please, let me know. Three days ago i have been by the stove. This was the first time to start the stove top down for me and it was the first time for me to start the floor channel batchbox in the way it has been designed to - top lit... The owner has been lighting smaller fires in it for the last weeks and he left the primary air inlet always open (even when there was no fire) to speed the drying of a heater. I must say that after a few weeks the difference in burning is very obvious, even though the heater seemed dry from the outside many weeks before... It would be nice to measure humidity inside the bricks and how it is lowering when weeks go by... So. The heater was still warm from the previous day. Exit temperature was 45-50°C. I loaded the box full and when it was half full i felt the draft through my fingers when i was putting the last bits of fuel and kindling on the top... At this time i began to understand the different procedure of lighting it from the top compared to the p-channel version. Also i began to understood the threshold function of diverting the air intake up and forward over the top of the fuel compared to my p-channel batchbox where the primary air is sucked through the fuel... floor channel starts much better when you fuel it at the top... Here is the first video, just some minutes after the start... Lets say at 2minutes of burning, bypass open... Because the exit temperature began to rise quickly i soon closed the bypass... The exit temperature dropped to about 60°C pretty soon. Still it was burning well... But very differently compared to my p-channel. I observed that with floor channel it burns lazier inside the firebox... Well the flame is still lively, but not darn speedy... 12 minutes of burning The rocketyness starts mainly in the heat riser... The exit temperature didnt rise over 65°C over mayor time of burning, 40 minutes of burning but when the coal phase started i put three more pieces o wood, and after awhile it reached 80°C... Some 15 minutes after that the ceiling and backwall of the firebox began to whiten because of the heat... 70 minutes of burning As of the white oven... Oh well.. It wont heat enough... Not at all with a single load of wood because the bottom of it is not heated - it is direcly connected to the ceiling of firebox... And the top is a bit too low... Temperature reached with two loads of wood would come to about 170°C, i doubt that it would get higher... Will report about that one. But for now all i can say that the oven should be probably put some 50 cm higher in the bell... Or to have a masonry oven with bricks at the highest point and bake with accumulation... It would be nicer to learn this part with my own heater  The heat comes through the brickwork in fat two hours, better yet 2 and a half... Slightly faster at the bench, because there is a single layer of bricks with plaster there... Now i see that the threshold should be even more airtight at the bottom towards the firebox... Flames there are not needed but do exist in this build - they are seen in some videos above... This is it. I would be very pleased if you comment my conclusions... Regards, Klemen |
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Post by Orange on Oct 28, 2017 8:58:21 GMT -8
well, I think you're correct about the oven being too low. Other than that it seems to extract and hold the heat well. How big is the place? and since the exit gases are 70-80C you can maybe add a bit more mass or ISA. Than we have a perfect forumula 180mm system = 8m2 ISA  |
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Post by peterberg on Oct 28, 2017 11:07:40 GMT -8
I seem to have missed your post Klemen, sorry for that.
Yes, the floor channel arrangement is acting a bit lazy as compared to the p-channel version. The threshold is partly responsible for that, the other thing is the secondary air is coming in lower, keeping the flames low in the riser part of the burn. Overfuelling is still possible but isn't such an isssue anymore, that is to say in my own heater. Overall, the floor channel arrangement reformes the heater quite drastically, that's true. I wanted to get rid of the very agressive nature of the original design and it seems it worked.
I am sorry to learn the oven isn't coming up to temp. The top of the firebox should be very hot when the heater is in daily use so maybe it's too early to draw conclusions now. Exit gases temps between 70-80º C are excellent, efficiency is on a par with mine. Don't add any ISA, the exit temp should be above 60º C anywway within 20 minutes from starting.
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grga
Junior Member
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Post by grga on Nov 3, 2017 1:29:23 GMT -8
I am a bit supprised to hear that. If the button is connected to the ceiling of the firebox then it should be hot enough? Did you isolate firebox ceiling or put the oven directly on it?
Obviously the white oven is mission impossible although there are some posts where the same position as yours works. And others where the oven is on top of the riser but still not working fine, at least not very hot.
My build is a bit slow down but I will soon continue and I plan to position the oven similarly as yours...
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Post by Jura on Oct 15, 2020 0:40:10 GMT -8
This is it. I would be very pleased if you comment my conclusions... Hi Klemen Sb. asked me for explanation about distances in a sidewinder. I provide him with a link to a specific post in this topic (I had it bookmarked) but... all the photos explaining the issue are gone. Any chances you'd share a link to the album where they are located,pls? regards BTW. Any news about this build after a few years? |
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dvawolk
Full Member
DSR2 125mm open system (actual project)
Posts: 271
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Post by dvawolk on Oct 16, 2020 5:55:09 GMT -8
Hi Klemen Sb. asked me for explanation about distances in a sidewinder. I provide him with a link to a specific post in this topic (I had it bookmarked) but... all the photos explaining the issue are gone. Any chances you'd share a link to the album where they are located,pls? regards BTW. Any news about this build after a few years? Hi, Jura... Shit, i saw that photos are gone - this goes to >3 months of inactivity for drivehq.com account. i contacted them if they can reenable my account otherwise images are gone... I will see what will they reply with... Can you give me a link to a specific post so that i know exactly what dimension are you interested about? And as for the news: the stove works well. It does take quite some time for it to heat but then it stays warm longer... But this is something that one should expect with such a heavy stove... Cheers, Klemen |
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Post by Jura on Oct 16, 2020 9:24:31 GMT -8
Can you give me a link to a specific post so that i know exactly what dimension are you interested about? I advised sb. to visit this link. donkey32.proboards.com/thread/3652/riser-port-location-sidewinder-rmh?page=1&scrollTo=34416Now I answered to sb. who asked about port location in a sidewinder. and I remember I also faced this issue and it was solved by your photos (U had put a lot of effort in the m as they contained dimension arrows And as for the news: the stove works well. It does take quite some time for it to heat but then it stays warm longer... But this is something that one should expect with such a heavy stove... I wonder if those metal clamps You installed (connecting the firebox bricks ) secured them from sliding away. |
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dvawolk
Full Member
DSR2 125mm open system (actual project)
Posts: 271
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Post by dvawolk on Oct 19, 2020 10:56:56 GMT -8
Those clamps worked well. Someone once said that similar technique was used in Tulikivi stoves, too. The bricks didn't move at all... As for the photos - they are gone from cloudHQ service BUT i did find them on my PC - for now they are available here: photos.app.goo.gl/7RExVDbgCCZNJECb8 |
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