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Post by patamos on Feb 15, 2015 22:52:01 GMT -8
I am enthralled with the vortex stove. And am also wondering about ways of tweaking the secondary burn for the utmost efficiency. Seems to me that evoking a more deliberate heat riser with turbulent elbow could achieve that. So i have done up a sketch with the basic idea. (already thinking of better ways to introduce secondary air…) vortex evo 115022015.pdf (365.28 KB) all feedback is most welcome... pat
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Post by satamax on Feb 15, 2015 23:59:06 GMT -8
Pat, this ressembles a bit Matt's angled riser, and there's a smidge of batch box too My impression is that it could be done a bit more rocket'y style. As Vortex reduced the lengh of his box, may be doing a brick partition at the end of the firebox, with a port; this could be feasible. And then, that space would also act as the begining of the heat riser. Following that, you could do a broken riser. instead of the flat channel with the elbow. A broken riser angled to the front as this flat channel is, but also to the side, to increase the working lengh of this heat riser. Imagine the riser doing a diagonal from one corner to the other, seing the stove from the top. Mind you, this is all theoretical. There's one observation from the range retrofit tho, the firebox and port are one size smaller than the heat riser. Firebox loosely based on a 10cm batch, rather short. and the heat riser is 12cm diameter, real short compared to what it should be. May be 67cm iirc. But this thing roars with the 11m chimney above. Hth. Max.
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Post by Vortex on Feb 16, 2015 11:18:13 GMT -8
Pat, I would think something like this would be worth a try, sounds like Max is thinking along similar lines. Personally I like having the firebox exit at the front it makes for a good show, but I agree some kind of horizontal riser before the fire comes out under the griddle would be the way to go.
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Post by patamos on Feb 16, 2015 23:04:20 GMT -8
Thanks guys, Much food for thought. This idea is simple enough to implement, and eliminates the need to insulate the riser. If i am wanting to keep the 12" x 18" x 12" firebox (for baking purposes) i wonder how that box to port transition will best shape up. And thanks Vortex for the okay to carry this discussion over to your original thread pat
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docbb
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Post by docbb on Apr 17, 2015 21:08:26 GMT -8
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Post by patamos on Apr 18, 2015 10:26:03 GMT -8
Thanks docbb, I remember viewing your forum post on the russian examples some time ago. As the rocket batch boxes evolve towards masonry fire chambers… i am not surprised to see Russian examples. In the heater i am currently building i decided to shape the fire box much the same as vortex has done, but with some trip wires and secondary air concentrated in to the throat. I wanted to make sure i can achieve the slow gasification burn that he can achieve when the primary air is closed. I am close to completion so we shall see. I do wonder about the pros and cons of having the throat at the front or rear… It is hard to know when something is done just out of habit, or for a reason that no longer applies as variables shift…
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docbb
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Post by docbb on Apr 23, 2015 23:52:50 GMT -8
Thanks docbb, I do wonder about the pros and cons of having the throat at the front or rear… In the case of the vertex stove, may be the heat into the knee should be taken in consideration as the highest temp should be there, it could be ans issue for the door/window.
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Post by patamos on Apr 27, 2015 10:26:18 GMT -8
Yes i have been thinking of how feeding the secondary air under the front lintel above the door could make for much heat. On the one hand i want the lintel to be hot so the air heats up. On the other, i do not want to thermally stress that piece. I have added fiberglass in sodium silicate to the outer front of it. ANd will add 1/8" ceramic felt to the underside of it (above the metal sleeve across the throat. Hopefully these will help achieve the desired secondary air heat and structural protection...
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Post by patamos on Nov 13, 2015 7:08:14 GMT -8
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