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Post by shilo on Nov 11, 2015 5:22:17 GMT -8
we realized that the true gob of the secondary air is not to add O2 (there is already to much). the true gob is to direct, to shape and to mix the flames to the right location and shape. the ability to bring a lot of secondary air is a minus because it cool the riser and drop the efficiency. so the important thing is speed. not volume. the solution is a wide channel that go above the fire box and/or inside the barrel and enter the fire box in the regular place or (better) between the box and the riser. the end of the channel is tapered to a slit about 10mm above the port. this bring small amount of very hot air in hi speed end push the flames down to create nice low flatten ram horns.
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Post by independentenergy on Nov 11, 2015 6:11:24 GMT -8
so you're saying that the oxygen supply of the second combustion air is not conclusive? but a high velocity flow would crush the flame downwards to create in addition to the ram horn another turbulence that makes better burn the gases? If this is true the road that has been covered so far was not entirely correct, he tried to add oxygen where oxygen was already there .. But simply a narrowing is able to implement this turbulence?
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Post by shilo on Nov 11, 2015 7:00:05 GMT -8
the strong speedy stream push the flame downwards to create a nicer ram horn turbulence that makes better burn the gases. yes, I think we followed the not correct pass until now.
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Post by patamos on Nov 11, 2015 8:21:16 GMT -8
Thanks for sharing Shilo,
I'm sure many of us have all kinds of questions that will be answered in time.
For now it appears the breakthrough is in optimizing turbulence and flame pattern above the port via secondary air delivery.
So is this stream of air/egr entering at a downward direction or horizontal? or either…?
Would be great to see a sketch or picture of the chet portal under construction. When you have time.
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Post by shilo on Nov 11, 2015 8:59:15 GMT -8
in my opinion, the main breakthrough is the option of shortening the riser and top gap and have no barrel in the living room. optimizing turbulence and flame pattern above the port via secondary air delivery is very interesting thing. adiel and I used to try deal with it with observations and peter used to work with the testo data. the combination of both the methods give a lot of new understandings.
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Post by shilo on Nov 11, 2015 9:35:37 GMT -8
here is a simple way to form a steady durable chet from 2 split firebricks.
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Post by independentenergy on Nov 11, 2015 9:40:26 GMT -8
I do not see the picture :-(
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Post by shilo on Nov 11, 2015 9:42:43 GMT -8
anywhere, here is not the place for it. I'm going to try again at the thread about the chet
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Post by patamos on Nov 11, 2015 10:30:20 GMT -8
Yes to both. The breakthrough of shorter riser etc… is made possible by optimizing turbulence and flame pattern above the port via secondary air delivery.
Awesome!
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Post by shilo on Nov 11, 2015 10:34:10 GMT -8
that was what we think at first. surprisingly, you can just shorten the riser and top gap and get no bad results
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Post by patamos on Nov 11, 2015 10:43:48 GMT -8
Compared to a shortened riser batch box without the chet, how does the new portal affect burn time, combustion efficiency or minimal stack temperatures ?
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Post by independentenergy on Nov 11, 2015 10:49:12 GMT -8
So I can also modify a batch box with Riser back , simply by cutting the riser 50 cm ?
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Post by shilo on Nov 11, 2015 10:57:01 GMT -8
the chet with 2/3 EGR 1/3 fresh air cause nice symmetrical flat ram horns that cause very low CO and relatively low o2 that cause nice efficiency numbers. lowering the ram horns take play in the stoves prone to overfueling.
if you want longer burn time or minimal stack temperatures you need to focus on the rest of the system. not just on the secondary air system. for example, our new primary air intake can be helpful but this is a topic for another thread..
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Post by shilo on Nov 11, 2015 10:59:33 GMT -8
I sure you can but we checked only with sided batchboxs
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morticcio
Full Member
"The problem with internet quotes is that you can't always depend on their accuracy" - Aristotle
Posts: 371
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Post by morticcio on Nov 13, 2015 2:06:20 GMT -8
the end of the channel is tapered to a slit about 10mm above the port. this bring small amount of very hot air in hi speed end push the flames down to create nice low flatten ram horns. Is this at 90°? I have a picture in my head of the existing P-channel being squashed at the end, ending up similar to a flat nozzle on a blow torch.
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